[HTML,Phreaky] Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby 60nowise » Wed, 10Apr14 21:46

@Arnulf:,tja, dumm darf man schon sein, man muss sich nur zu helfen wissen [img]images/icones/icon13.gif[/img]
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby okimaon1 » Thu, 10Apr15 01:05

Rikwar wrote :
You have a very strange way of thinking okimaon1 what would be the point of a game developer that spends so many hours creating such a game then to included a walkthrough with it !!
If your only purpose is to cruise through a game well the Meet n fuck games are better suited for you ...



@Rikwar - Well thank you. I'd prefer the term unique way of thinking.
Why do you think people are asking for walkthroughs? why do people use cheats in games? for some people (like me) it makes the game more fun. what's so bad about a walkthrough? if you don't want to, don't use it. I'm just saying it should be the player's choice.
Are you against being able to choose?
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby Lupiscanis » Thu, 10Apr15 05:08

okimaon1 wrote :


@Rikwar - Well thank you. I'd prefer the term unique way of thinking.
Why do you think people are asking for walkthroughs? why do people use cheats in games? for some people (like me) it makes the game more fun. what's so bad about a walkthrough? if you don't want to, don't use it. I'm just saying it should be the player's choice.
Are you against being able to choose?


If it's the player's choice, why are you asking the authors to write the walkthroughs?
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby TheBrain » Thu, 10Apr15 06:46

okimaon1 wrote :
what's so bad about a walkthrough? if you don't want to, don't use it.

There's a big difference between not liking walkthroughs and thinking authors should not be obliged to include one (one that note, I don't feel authors have many obligations, you should be happy they take the time to make the games). Sure we all need a hint sometime, but that's what the community is for.

I'm just saying it should be the player's choice.
Are you against being able to choose?

This is just bad argumentation: what about the authors choice to not include a walkthrough?
You should realize that you're making a very selfish demand. Using a walkthrough makes 90% of the authors work basically useless because you're no longer playing a game, you're just clicking through a story. If the author didn't intend on giving us a challenge he would've just written a nice story (or indeed as rikwar suggested: made games like the meet 'n fuck series). Given that a walkthrough removes any challenge, then why the hell should (your word) an author include one?
If you're not looking for a challenge then these games are not for you: you're just looking for porn (and if you don't know how to find that, I feel very sorry for you).
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby tlaero » Thu, 10Apr15 09:38

Hey Phreaky,

Yeah, you wouldn't want to modify an existing working game with new tech. Better to use it on your next game.

Now, let's talk about the non-techie stuff in the Amy game.

First, I also like Amy's face. I didn't like Jen as much, though. Her face was a bit angular. Are you using V4? If so, check out http://www.pixeluna.com/poser_stuff.html
Assuming you've got the morph++ pack for V4, Pixeluna has a lot of free alternate faces you can use either as starting points or straight out. Maybe stick to your own faces for the primary characters but use some of the free ones for other characters, etc.

I also liked that we got to see part of the player for the sex scenes. That allowed you to provide better camera angles and showed off the acts better. Good idea.

Personally, prefer Chaotic's realistically sized breasts, but I appreciate that you didn't go overboard in that regard. Amy was extremely well endowed, but at least she still looked human. Contrast this to the meet'n'fuck games where the girls have beach balls for breasts. Those games are just stupid on so many levels.

I think you did a great job, especially for your first try at this sort of thing. I know you were working out the posing and the html more than the plot and story. I'm sure that as you do more of those things you'll be able to devote more time to the story and gameplay. Hopefully as you start to see what those Jscrïpt functions allow, they'll give you room to be really creative with the other parts.

So, while I'm about to give a lot of suggestions on things to do differently, please don't see them as criticisms. You're off to a great start. As with anything else, you'll get better with practice. Also, while I'll give examples from Amy, I'm not really suggesting you change the current game. I'm more talking about doing these kinds of things in future games.

I think these games would benefit from some interface consistency. I personally believe that you should always put things you SAY in the three boxes below the picture and things you DO as click targets on the picture. This isn’t as limiting as it may seem. Say the picture shows a room with a door. If you click on the door, the caption would be, “Suggest going through the door.” But if you wanted to do the same thing with the boxes below the picture, the text would be, “Let’s go through the door.” Similarly, when you first meet her, clicking on her body might say, “Complement her athletic body,” while the text box might say, “Do you work out, because you’ve got a great body.” With that concept, you can still do pretty much anything you want.

But consider the truth or dare scene when Amy told you to slap her. In the box below you’d have, “There’s no way I’d slap you!” but in the picture you’d have a hit target on her face that says, “Slap her face.” Then you’d have another hit target on her rear end that says, “Spank her.” And, maybe you’d have a hit target on her breasts that says, “Gently hit her breasts.” She’d most likely react negatively to being slapped in the face, but could react positively to the other situations, depending on previous things you’d done on the date. And, maybe you’d have another text box that says, “Where do you want to be slapped?” which could result in her saying something really provocative and sexy.

In your game, many of the things you say don’t really apply to the hit target you have to find to say them. For instance, if I remember right, the, “There’s no way I’d slap you” is a hit target on her belly. Why there and not her face? Or the palm tree behind her? Etc. No target makes sense because it’s something you say. That’s why you should put it in the text boxes at the bottom. If you do that consistently, and you also make the hit targets always be an action on that thing, the game will make much more sense to the player. Right now it’s “Sweep my mouse around to figure out my options.” What you want is the player to say, “She told me to slap her??? Hymm, I can see her butt, maybe I can spank her instead.” The game’s challenge shouldn’t come from searching for hit targets. It should come from needing to think about what to do next. I believe that having words below the picture and actions on the picture will help.

Next suggestion: Be a little more forgiving. I LIKE that these games are hard. That’s where most of the fun comes from (contrast again to the meet’n’fuck games). But they’re currently hard for the wrong reason. It’s nigh on impossible to figure these games out by thinking through the challenges. You pretty much need to do a lot of trial and error.

The main problem is all the arbitrary dead ends. For instance, if you go for a walk on the beach, the ONLY option you have is “ask her to show some skin” and that’ll fail if you didn’t happen to buy her a swimsuit first. But when you see the option to go for a walk, there’s really no way to know that you have to do other things first. So you’re almost guaranteed to fail. Another example, you get her into the bedroom after a lot of steps, and she takes a shower and comes out in underwear, but if you ask her to dance, the game is going to end unless you bought a dildo 25 turns ago? How could anyone know that?

I suggest the following design principle. At the beginning and middle of any path, there are few “dead ends.” I say “few” because some things should stop the game regardless (slapping her face, for instance). But walking on the beach should, minimally, have an option to walk back to the pool. It shouldn’t be that making a rude suggestion 2 minutes after you met her is your ONLY option. Especially when doing something as innocuous as walking on a beach. I mean, if you were suggesting going into a strip club, that would be one thing. But no reasonable player would realize that going on the beach is a short trip to a game restart. Let the player figure out he’s missed something and let him go back and rectify that.

Next, every negative end should have SOME sort of hint at what you should have done instead. For instance, on the beach, when you suggest she shows more skin, she could say, “But I don’t have a bathing suit.” Then, whether you end the game there or not, the player has some idea what he needs to do differently. Similarly, rather than, “You’re making Jen uncomfortable” when kissing Amy was the only option, she could say, “We’re not nearly drunk enough to be doing that.” Etc. And, ideally, on many of the early ones, don’t end the game there. Don’t end the game when she says “I don’t have a bathing suit.” Let it continue and have the player go get her one. The game will get easier, but that will allow you to make it harder for the RIGHT reasons. If it’s hard because the girl is complicated and you have to work at figuring her out, that’s COOL. If it’s hard because you keep needing to redo the start to blindly walk down dead end paths until you stumble across the right one, it’s not cool.

Even though this is a sex game, and you’re going for titillation, you can get your players to be hugely invested if you give them the thrill of figuring something out. On a very small scale, that’s her saying, “but I don’t have a bathing suit” and you saying, “Aha! I need to buy her one.” On a bigger scale it’s her being proud of her workout ethic when you compliment her body, so you take her to the gym to impress her with your work out regimen. While that’s going on, she says that she likes working out with you and complains that her previous boyfriend hated to work out with her because he didn’t like being near sweaty people. (Depending on how hard you want to be, you might have her add that wouldn’t go near her after a workout unless she showered first.) So you figure out that you’ll score big points by kissing her when she’s sweaty. It does, and leads to her inviting you into the shower with her. There’s a huge thrill in reading something and saying, “Oh! That probably means I should do this.” There’s no thrill in figuring things out by brute force.

I could go on, but this is a lot to digest. So I’ll leave it at this for now. I’m looking forward to your next game.

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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby bforce » Thu, 10Apr15 11:31

Very good advice - agreed to a 100%!

Upcoming projects could be REALLY improved by taking this (and previous) advice... really looking forward to future games!
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby erana » Thu, 10Apr15 14:08

Tlaero is giving so good advice that is making mine unneeded, as I was gonna say almost the same exact things. Other than complimenting Phreaky for making this game.
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby luke » Thu, 10Apr15 15:23

Rikwar wrote : Thanks Arnulf for your last reply, I do have photoshop but find it somewhat complicated at times, so will try "Microsoft Photo Editor" have seen it as a free download on a web site !

Well off to work now, wishing you and all a great day [img]images/icones/icon10.gif[/img]

Looking forward to your add-on phreaky on a personal note seeing this will be an add-on I would put your new link to the game under the one you have in your first post, so not to have multiple questions about the game, but thats only my opinion [img]images/icones/icon10.gif[/img]

Personnaly, when i have to work on pics and photos, i use 2 softwares, depending on the OS :
Photofiltre under Windows, freeware, many possibilities, a little less than photoshop
The Gimp (of course) under Linux

@phreaky
[img]kator/smiley95.gif[/img] Very nice game, great pics, especially the boobs, huge, but natural looking. Keep up the good work. [img]kator/smiley95.gif[/img]

And to answer your question, yes, you can use this thread for posting the next version of the game. The most simple is to write a post saying that you release a new version, and editing your first post with the link.
Que la Force de Shark soit avec toi / May the Shark Force be with you
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby Rikwar » Thu, 10Apr15 16:08

luke wrote :
Personnaly, when i have to work on pics and photos, i use 2 softwares, depending on the OS :
Photofiltre under Windows, freeware, many possibilities, a little less than photoshop
The Gimp (of course) under Linux

Thanks for your input Luke, so it all comes down to whatever software each one is most comfortable with [img]kator/smiley20.gif[/img]

Nice job on the animated tits 60nowise after looking at them was getting a little hypnotised [img]images/icones/icon9.gif[/img] [img]images/icones/icon10.gif[/img]
The greatest danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby phreaky » Thu, 10Apr15 17:39

@tlaero

Thanks a lot man, your advices are really cool, and mostly I agree wholeheartedly :)
Well, like u mention, and I did mention it too, I tend to focus on the pics, pose, dress etc

And it's so easy to be lost and forgot the details of the story of the game

Being a rookie, I admit that :)
The truth is I was abit lazy to make the game more consistent, like the map I'd location of thumbs, and the format of the dialog, and the hints

I guess I got carried away of tring to make the game hard, but as u say, more like a trial and error
Next time I will think more of that

As for the model, actually I used V3 and modify the face and body morph based on my liking
Amy may not be that beautiful, but I like her cause her face looks pretty real, and her body too
Jen, I make her to be more of a model figure, not really as realistic as Amy
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby TheBrain » Thu, 10Apr15 20:14

Phreaky, in case you're looking for some more ideas and thoughts on the whole trial and error thing, it reminded me of a thread we had here a while back:
http://sharks-lagoon.aceboard.fr/215394 ... -forum.htm

It's a long read, but quite a few people gave their input on what they consider good games and what they think is important. I thought you might find it interesting.
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby okimaon1 » Thu, 10Apr15 23:24

TheBrain wrote :
There's a big difference between not liking walkthroughs and thinking authors should not be obliged to include one (one that note, I don't feel authors have many obligations, you should be happy they take the time to make the games). Sure we all need a hint sometime, but that's what the community is for.


This is just bad argumentation: what about the authors choice to not include a walkthrough?
You should realize that you're making a very selfish demand. Using a walkthrough makes 90% of the authors work basically useless because you're no longer playing a game, you're just clicking through a story. If the author didn't intend on giving us a challenge he would've just written a nice story (or indeed as rikwar suggested: made games like the meet 'n fuck series). Given that a walkthrough removes any challenge, then why the hell should (your word) an author include one?
If you're not looking for a challenge then these games are not for you: you're just looking for porn (and if you don't know how to find that, I feel very sorry for you).



Look, Brain and Rikwar - I admire the work artists do here. I wouldn't be a regular visitor to this site otherwise, would I?
My idea in my first post, was to bring out an idea. You certainly don't have to accept it, but please don't patronize it/me by suggesting what other games I can play.

I learned from your response that you think game creators create games to challenge gamers. Since it is art, I don't think it's only that. those girls are amazing (I really fell in love with Crystal for a while...I actually miss her) regardless of game play. for me it doesn't matter so much how I got to the end. If I enjoyed a game and expressed it to the artist - is he less satisfied with it if I did it with a walkthrough? I am not sure. maybe Phreaky can answer that. It's an interesting question.

Any way, bottom line - I think you two are making way too big of a deal from what I wrote. I can assure you it was written in good spirit and not intended to offend anyone.
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby Rikwar » Fri, 10Apr16 04:40

Get over it okimaon1, I replied to your comment once 3 pages ago, I didnt patronise you just gave you my opinion !
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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby tlaero » Fri, 10Apr16 09:54

I don't think you were being lazy, Phreaky. These projects are large, complicated, and take a lot of time. It's really cool that you're doing them for us. Your games will just get better and better from here.

Wow. I'm impressed that you were able to make V3 look that good. Just so you're aware, Daz has made all of their base characters (including V4 and M4) free. So if you want to play with V4, it's an inexpensive crossover. Of course, then you'll decide that you want morph++ and elite bodies and a good skin texture and suddenly it doesn't seem so free anymore. (-:

I was thinking more about these games. Would your life be any easier if you could make the background be a separate image from the characters and then have the html overlay them? The HTML is fairly easy, but it requires some photoshop manipulation.

To use this, you need to make the foreground (characters) image the same size as the background image, and you want to make everything that's not the characters be transparent. Jpegs don't allow transparency, but PNGs do. So you'd need to save your character images in PNG instead of jpeg. But, assuming you have a background called background.jpg and a character called character.png, the img tag is just:



Here's a longer version that shows the maps you're probably using:




In other words, do exactly what you're doing now, but add a
style="background:url(background.jpg)"
for the background.

I'm not sure if that would make things easier or harder. I think, in the end, though, it would make your downloads smaller. I'm thinking about how Chaotic had multiple games in the same location but had to keep reshipping the backgrounds because the different characters were superimposed on them. If you separated them, you could potentially save some space.

On the other hand, if this makes things more work and slows you down, just stick with what you know. I'll gladly spend the time on the download if it means more games sooner. (-:

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Re: Virtual Date with Amy (New game)

Postby Squeeky » Fri, 10Apr16 10:25

Wow!

For these type of comments, pseudo-tutorial as well as the constructive critiques, I'm thinking this should have been transferred to "Projects" but to attempt that now Yoda might exclaim that "there is a disturbance in the Force", or similar.
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