Greyelf wrote:@Tlaero (and anyone else for that matter)

I understand you are using double touch to simulate mouse cursor hover to show tool-tips, what touch technique equates to finding a hot-spot like the way cursor shape change is used in games like the ones by MSP?

(note: I know you can drag a cursor sprite around a scene using touch but the problem is that cursor is under your finger/thumb so harder to see when it changes shape.)

As you know Java is another way for a Browser, to access System Resources. For a touch pad to work. There would have to be a new Browser, that supports a newer Java variant. Then new Java routine calls, that then can talk to OS, to get information back from the touch-screen driver. Since mice already exist, Java has those routines available.

So it's basically, wait for the Java community to figure out, how to make the calls universal for the Browsers. Then the Browser community to create a new version, that can utilize the new Java routines. This goes way back to when Java was created. And Bill Gates wanted Microsoft to either have it's own Java variant. Just like with Microsoft Office products, he could utilize hidden optimized code. To work faster with the OS, so Microsoft Internet Explorer running MS-Java. Would be faster than Netscape, running open source Java. For you young 'uns. Netscape was killed off by AOL. So the open source community, created Firefox/Mozilla. Based on good ol' Netscape. I even have a Weird Al Parody. "AOL killed the Internet Star".

Course also, if you take the amount of repetitive clicking into account, and then transfer that to a touch screen, would the touch screen even survive lol.

In the MSP game final exam, when the guy is about to enter Annie, mouse wise that scene to complete needs a LOT of repetitive clicking, would the touch screen even survive that, aside from me wanting to LOL here, I don't think the technology is anywhere close to were it needs to be yet for your online experience to be eventually solely touch screen.

My bank has solely touch screen for most transactions, and no lie here it is not the best at all, so add a game into that mix with how games are actually played now, and you would be into a nightmare scenario where a great game becomes very average because the actual touch screen technology is not even close to the spec it should be at right now.

tlaero wrote:Thank you for the feedback so far, folks. Keep it coming.

SoulMate wrote:As webprogrammer i'm really interested in why mouse and touch are mutually exclusive.

The issue is that mouse control relies on "onmousemove," and there's currently no cross-browser equivalent for touch. There are good solutions coming, especially the pointer stuff, but nothing is yet supported on all of the big 3.

Tlaero

There is the "touchmove" (and "MSPointerMove" for mobile IE), supported by most mobile browsers (except for Opera Mini, but who's using that?)
http://caniuse.com/#feat=touch
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/doc ... TouchEvent

The touch support for desktop browsers is terrible, only chrome does support it.
But all the desktop browsers can use the mouse, so that wouldn't be a problem too.

TeineWolf wrote:As you know Java is another way for a Browser, to access System Resources.

I am assuming you actually meant Java-script, which has almost no relationship to Java besides having a similar name and some basic language constructs.

There is a similar problem with accessing features like camera, mic, tilt, etc in browser based web-apps, where you have to use third-party java-script libraries supplied by the manufacture of the device to access them and these libraries are different for each manufacture which cause all sort of fun and games when coding.

If you did mean Java then the problem is that the Apple iOS license (and the App Store) does not allow it to be used, so the "Wait for a better Browser" solution will not work.

SoulMate wrote:The touch support for desktop browsers is terrible, only chrome does support it.

I hope support for touch on the desktop dies as I (nor I would guess my end-users) am not looking forward to Gorilla Arms, though the medical industry might be! lol

Greyelf wrote:

SoulMate wrote:The touch support for desktop browsers is terrible, only chrome does support it.

I hope support for touch on the desktop dies as I (nor I would guess my end-users) am not looking forward to Gorilla Arms, though the medical industry might be! lol

could happen, stress fatigue from repetitive touch screen touching, that would be both sad and funny as an injury in a hospital

Even worse when they actually got you to tell them the truth of what it was you were doing on a touch screen so fast and repetitively, well I was playing an Adult sex game, surely some young intern would record it and stick it on you tube

Interesting that the present touchscreen fad is ignoring the '80s realisation of the "Gorilla Arm" problem -- maybe it's time to get back to developing the use of eye movements for action input!

Has to be mouse for me too... I know that may make it more difficult to produce versions of games that can be paid on tablets, mobile phones, etc, but considering most of us are on limited funds, I can't see the sense in replacing a perfectly good monitor with a touch screen when it means using money that could otherwise be spent on apps and/or hardware that let me do more stuff, not just do the same stuff in a different way.

Greebo wrote:Interesting that the present touchscreen fad is ignoring the '80s realisation of the "Gorilla Arm" problem -- maybe it's time to get back to developing the use of eye movements for action input!

As always, the technology is there in place for touch screen, for a virtual keyboard and a host of other cool things, but it is no where up to the spec it needs to be at for well games even.

I played a game in an arcade with my Dad when I was 11, it was a flying motorcycle but it was virtual reality, it was awesome, but it got shelved like most amazing things do and is only really now making a re appearance and people are saying wow virtual reality wow and I am saying it is nothing new, and the technology for it is no where up to the spec it should be at now.

same applies to touch screen, fine on phones, and tablets and fine for playing slow moving games, but put a game in place which needs fast actions and touch screen really begins to show its flaws very fast, no pun intended there

Mouse is sadly the only perfected technology for point and click games, also when I say Mouse, I do mean an optical external USB Mouse, as the built in mouse in most laptops is not up to spec either for real games.

My vote is for mouse control of these interactions, and an ability to skip them for those playing on touch.

Full disclosure: I'm personally not a big fan of the wiggle the mouse mini-game element but when I am playing one, I'd much prefer a mouse cursor being in the way of the image to my big, meaty hand obscuring the entire image.

Wolfschadowe

Greyelf wrote:

TeineWolf wrote:As you know Java is another way for a Browser, to access System Resources.

I am assuming you actually meant Java-script, which has almost no relationship to Java besides having a similar name and some basic language constructs.

Correct.

Java-script is a CLI version of compilable/executable Java.

Greebo wrote:Interesting that the present touchscreen fad is ignoring the '80s realisation of the "Gorilla Arm" problem

Every new generation thinks THEY can reinvent the wheel. So much in this world that used to be "as good as it gets" is now junk.

M

Edit: BTW, I was given a touch pad (this mess in the middle of my laptop), in the mid 1990's. I work with spreadsheets a lot, and the pad woefully failed at the accuracy+quickness of the mouse.

Mimailia wrote:

Greebo wrote:Interesting that the present touchscreen fad is ignoring the '80s realisation of the "Gorilla Arm" problem

Every new generation thinks THEY can reinvent the wheel. So much in this world that used to be "as good as it gets" is now junk.

M

Edit: BTW, I was given a touch pad (this mess in the middle of my laptop), in the mid 1990's. I work with spreadsheets a lot, and the pad woefully failed at the accuracy+quickness of the mouse.

The mouse I use today, from the outside resembles what I started with (I prefer wired, so it still has it's tail), but turn it over and where's the large marble? And why is that red light there?
It performs better and for longer with fewer problems. Not so much for the original. It was attached to 286 Computer Products United® with turbo and 1 meg of ram (on the motherboard chips... a bunch of them!). It was shipped new to Germany 1985 or 6. I still have it and it still works, a DOS machine that's never run windows. Had this manufacturer not supported APOs Dell was my next attempt.
We're in full agreement on touch pads.

LRM wrote:

Mimailia wrote:

Greebo wrote:Interesting that the present touchscreen fad is ignoring the '80s realisation of the "Gorilla Arm" problem

Every new generation thinks THEY can reinvent the wheel. So much in this world that used to be "as good as it gets" is now junk.

M

Edit: BTW, I was given a touch pad (this mess in the middle of my laptop), in the mid 1990's. I work with spreadsheets a lot, and the pad woefully failed at the accuracy+quickness of the mouse.

The mouse I use today, from the outside resembles what I started with (I prefer wired, so it still has it's tail), but turn it over and where's the large marble? And why is that red light there?
It performs better and for longer with fewer problems. Not so much for the original. It was attached to 286 Computer Products United® with turbo and 1 meg of ram (on the motherboard chips... a bunch of them!). It was shipped new to Germany 1985 or 6. I still have it and it still works, a DOS machine that's never run windows. Had this manufacturer not supported APOs Dell was my next attempt.
We're in full agreement on touch pads.

They replaced the little round ball in the older Mouses or Mice, no Mouses, as over time the ball, would like most men, shrink in size where it counts
The little red light is there to remind you that Red Light districts are BAD